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Topic: Great Egret 大白鷺 (Read 894 times) |
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antonio
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Great Egret 大白鷺
« on: Nov 27th, 2003, 11:01pm » |
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016 Great Egret 大白
Luk Keng Temple 鹿頸 觀音廟
22/11/2003
Nikon F100 + Sigma 50-500mm f/6.3
I don't know why but there seems to be something wrong with the lens -> very serious grey corners on photos even without lens hood.
This is my first time posting photos here. As there are so many experts here, I would like to get your advice about buying a better lens 
I would like to buy a tele lens that is fast enough to capture (i.e. using auto-focus) flying birds. However with limited budget, I am thinking about the following options:
Expensive options:
Canon EF 300mm f/2.8 IS USM + 1.4x or 2x
Sigma 500mm f/4.5 HSM
Economy options:
Canon EF 300mm f/4 IS USM + 1.4x
Canon EF 100-400mm f/5.6 IS USM
Any advice is much appreciated
http://www.geocities.com/antcheng334/egret.html
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| « Last Edit: May 20th, 2004, 5:43pm by BBS Moderators » |
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Anguslau
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Re: Egret 白鷺
« Reply #1 on: Nov 28th, 2003, 9:16pm » |
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Hi Antonio,
I am no expert in bird photog, in fact I am a beginner as well (only started for a few months). But since I did quite a bit of research on this topic and also owned a 300 f2.8, I can share some of my thoughts.
Don't know about the Sigma, so no comment on that one.
The 300 f2.8 is a very sharp and versatile lens. Go extremely well with both 1.4x & 2x converters. Basically you can shoot wide open with either converters without significant image degradation. But AF with the 2x is a bit slow for flight shots. I even stack the converters for still shots with pretty good results so long as I stop down one full stop. On my 10D, AF still works reasonably ok with the stacked converters. Although I am small build, I can hand hold the 300 (or with 1.4x) for occasional shootings.
I heard that the 300 f4 is almost as sharp as the f2.8. But it probably don't perform as well with the 2x converter. Its short near focus makes it a very good macro lens. Its very light and "small", so you should be able to use it a lot more and won't draw as much attention.
The 100-400 is a versatile zoom lens. Excellent for shooting butterflies. Its probably not as sharp as the 300 f4, but good for a lot more other subjects as well apart from birds. If your interest is not only birds or you do not already own a 70-200 or similar, it may be a good choice.
Of course, if you are real serious about bird photog, nothing beats the 500/600 f4. For me, I have no regret getting the 300 f2.8. It is one of my favourite lens - extremely pleased about it. Though I'll probably get a 500/600 some day...
Just my thoughts. Hope it helps.
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KK Hui
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Re: Egret 白鷺
« Reply #2 on: Nov 29th, 2003, 9:21am » |
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antonio,
On a tight budget, the Sigma 50-500 is a bargain; a sharp lens although a little slow.
The black four corners you're experiencing is known as vignetting. Vignetting is inherent to each lens design. Most photographic lenses exhibit optical vignetting to some degree. The effect is strongest when the lens is used wide open and will disappear when the lens is stopped down by a few stops. Expensive lenses tend to have much less of this problem due to better design and special optical elements used.
I agree with most of what Anguslau already said. And since you're using Nikon, an AF-S 300/2.8D ED with TC14E & TC20E will be a good start for nature photography including birds. If you are shooting mainly birds, anything shorter than 400mm is not recommended. This is where Canon has a better choice. It's EF400/5.6L is a superb lens for handheld birds in flight photography ...
KK Hui ARPS
www.geocities.com/kkhui_001
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| « Last Edit: Nov 29th, 2003, 9:22am by KK Hui » |
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antonio
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Re: Egret 白鷺
« Reply #3 on: Nov 30th, 2003, 12:08am » |
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Hi Anguslau & KK Hui,
Thanks a lot for the valuable advices. FYI, I have just returned my 50-500mm lens to Sigma for repair. The technician told me that the four dark corners ("vignetting" as explained by KK) may be the "characteristics" of the lens and there may not be any "problem" with the lens. I told him that the problem is so serious and it appeared on every single photo out of my 3 rolls of film. I will have the final answer some time next week.
Regarding camera, I have been using Nikon for years. All the Nikon lenses I have are just AF, not AF lenses, e.g. AF80-200 f/2.8. I found that the auto-focus is very slow especially when taking photos of children. Besides, Canon seems to be more prepared (maybe also have more money) to produce digital SLR. As a result, I am in the initial stage of migrating to Canon.
I have got the EOS-3 (cannot afford the EOS-1V) and EF70-200mm f/4 lens. Some time next year, there should be 3 new models of digital SLR from Canon and I am saving my money for one.
Well, back to the lens. I am thinking about buying Canon EF300mm f/4 + 1.4x. However, I am not sure if that combination will be slower than EF400mm f/5.6. Any idea  The other conern is that "if" I will be finally able to buy the EF300mm f/2.8 lens, the EF300mm f/4 will become redundant.
My ideal lens for photographing birds is Canon 500mm f/4 + 1.4x (plus 1.6x with Canon digital SLR). One thing makes me sad is that the Nikon AFS 300mm f/2.8 (HK$2x,xxx) is much cheaper than Canon's 300mm f/2.8 USM IS (HK$3x,xxx).
Once again, thanks a lot for your help!
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Lynx
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Re: Egret 白鷺
« Reply #4 on: Nov 30th, 2003, 12:31am » |
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Hi Antonio,
Sigma 50-500 should be okay for bird photography. For the vignetting problem, it can usually be reduced by stepping down the aperture. Is the problem only occur in your lens when the aperture is wide-open?
I suggest you to consder a D-SLR instead of buying new lens or switch system, e.g. Fuji S2-Pro. It can automatically solve the vignetting problem of your Sigma 50-500 due to the smaller sensor size and also give you a 1.5X.
You might have a look at some of the photos taken by Sky4082 using Sigma 50-500 on a D-SLR:
http://www.hkbws.org.hk/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=BirdingTips;action=di splay;num=1068911385
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| « Last Edit: Nov 30th, 2003, 2:55pm by Lynx » |
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Welcome to Lynx Aviary
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antonio
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Re: Great Egret 大白鷺
« Reply #5 on: Dec 3rd, 2003, 11:49pm » |
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Hi Lynx,
Thanks for the advice. I just got the reply back from Sigma Hong Kong about my 50-500mm lens. They said my lens is in good conditions and they have checked with Sigma Japan and told me that the "dark corners" are "normal"!! According to them, the dark corners will become more obvious for the type of background in my photos. I have expressed my big disappointment to them.
I used to shoot with the lens wide-open. It did not have the problem before. Maybe I can try shooting with f/11 provided that there is enough sunshine.
Regarding digital SLR, I still prefer to use either Nikon or Canon. The prices of Nikon D100 and Canon 10D are within my budget, but I am still waiting for one with better quality (in terms of PC interface, shutter lag, and Mil pixels) within the same price range. I will buy a D-SLR in 2004.
I may take KK Hui's advice to buy a Canon EF 400mm f/5.6 lens. I got the chance to test the lens during the recent Canon expo. The auto-focus speed of the lens seems to be very high.
Cheers!
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Griffin
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DSLR and lenses for birding
« Reply #6 on: Dec 4th, 2003, 2:18pm » |
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This may not be the best place to talk about gears but well... 
If you are using Nikon mount cameras, S2 Pro is arguablly a better choice than D100 in DSLR category. It is rugged, has brighter, larger viewfinder, great contrast range and generates the lowest noise at high ISO. However, according to Dec 2003 CAPA magazine, S2 Pro suffers from slow startup time and larger shutter lag. Nikon has just announed a consumer-priced D70 so you may wish to wait. Expect the new offering from Fuji (S3 Pro?) using her 3rd generation SuperCCD next year.
Well, if you are into Canon family, hehe... 
For lens, Sigma 50-500mm is a very good lens. I have read rave reports on Sigma 120-300mm f/2.8 elsewhere. If you don't like 3rd party lenses, for Nikon, as KK mentioned, AF-S 80-400mm VR ED IF and AF-S 300mm f/2.8 ED IF are a great starter, see works from "WilsonChan", his posts are mainly from the 300mm. There is a upcoming AF-S 200-400mm f/4 DX but I am not sure if itis good or not.
For Canon, EF400mm f/5.6 L USM, according to many, is a great starter lens for its sharpness and ease of handling. However, the lack of IS may be a hinderance to some. EF100-400mm L IS USM is a good choice, not the mention the superb EF300mm f/4 L IS USM which is even more afforadable. Also, EF400mm f/4 DO IS is an great light-weight lens, if you could afford it.
If you are going into long telephooto lenses (300mm f/2.8 and above), make sure you invest into some stable and lightweight supports, for almost all of them are not handholdable, even with IS-sic technology. My advice would be, you also have to take the weight, transportation and storage into considerations.
On the other hand, digiscoping is always an option, even for DSLR.
Griffin.
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Daniel CK Chan
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Re: Great Egret 大白鷺
« Reply #7 on: Dec 4th, 2003, 3:27pm » |
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Hi Antonio,
I just want to share my experience in switching from Nikon to Canon for bird photography. The decision was made after knowing (shall be not knowing actually) Nikon products launching schedule, as well as having consulted my friends around including KK. I am sorry if the followings will irritate your decision.
I used to have Nikon F100, AFS300/4 and TC14E for bird photography. As you might expect that I always found it insufficient. Then I decided to save money to have my super tele lens. Similar to you that I used to have many Nikon gears like flash and lenses covering range from 20mm to 300mm and 2 tele converters. So it was a hard decision for my switch. Instead, I awaited for the new version of Nikon AFS VR super tele lens at that moment.
When Nikon introduced its AFS500 II and AFS600 II with same specification of version I except lighter weight, I had consulted Nikon JP and HK but the answers were not acceptable to me. I did not want to waste time for waiting for my dream lenses (Nikon AFS VR 500 and 600). I had switched to Canon by having Canon 1V and EF500 IS lenses in May 2002.
[To be continued on next post]
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| « Last Edit: Dec 4th, 2003, 3:46pm by Daniel CK Chan » |
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Daniel CK Chan
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Daniel CK Chan
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Re: Great Egret 大白鷺
« Reply #8 on: Dec 4th, 2003, 3:27pm » |
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[Continue from previous post]
I am now able to concentrate on improving my technique on bird photography, watching and identification with my Canon setup instead of equipment fine tune. I am not saying that Canon is better than Nikon. As I still miss some functions and ergonomical design of Nikon bodies, lenses and flash. I also think that AFS VR 500 and 600 would be an excellent lenses for birds photography if it exists. Since you already have Canon and Nikon bodies and lenses, you can wait to see if new Canon DSLR or new Nikon big guns introduced sometimes next year that will best suit your needs and for your final decision. Meanwhile, you can make use of your Sigma lens to improve technique.
That says, I recommend you to find a system that you feel comfortable, then use it best and expand its power to enhance your photo qualities. In fact, there are many great and excellent Nikon and Canon birds photographers in the world.
Again, hope that it will not irritate your decision.
Regards
Daniel
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Daniel CK Chan
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Lynx
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Re: Great Egret 大白鷺
« Reply #9 on: Dec 4th, 2003, 10:40pm » |
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Antonio:
To further irritate your decision, here are some latest news on new products:
1. Nikon is going to release a new D-SLR named D70 in spring 2004, at the price range of Canon's EOS300D. D70 will be based on F75.
2. Canon US has discontinued EF400/5.6L. Probably a new lens (with IS function?) will be announced in the coming PMA2004 in February.
3. Canon is rumoured to be announcing a new D-SLR before February 2004. It would likely be an upgrade version of EOS1D to rival Nikon's new D2H.
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Welcome to Lynx Aviary
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Griffin
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Re: Great Egret 大白鷺
« Reply #10 on: Dec 5th, 2003, 10:47am » |
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I agree with CK.
Knowing a lot about cameras, lenses and owning a lot of stuff do not automatically make one a great photographer, let alone a bird photographer. Read, watch, discuss and practise a lot helps.
IMHO, in the avant of digital photography, whether your set of equipment is great/sharp is less and less relevant. There are software tools out there which helps "fix" your work even your equipment are "sub-standard". On the other hand, current technology still cannot "save" those caused by basic errors. I have seen great birding works come out from consumer-grade equipment. So I would suggest since you have already had your own setup, stick with it and make good use of it. I can see your in-flight photographs way better than mine. 
Time to work out my "beta-quality" photographs.
Thanks for reading this silly post.
Griffin.
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Anguslau
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Re: Great Egret 大白鷺
« Reply #11 on: Dec 5th, 2003, 7:26pm » |
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Antonio,
Couldn't resist to join in with the discussion here. Talking about 'fixing' photos. Just wanted to highlight one point in case you do not already aware. The vignetting problem that you see on the Sigma 50-500 lens should be very easy to fix. In fact, fixing vignetting effect on optical systems is a standard step in CCD astrophotography since many years ago. What you do is to shoot a 'flat frame' (such as a white sky) to characterise your optical system. Using this info, you can then scale your normal pictures to correct the vignetting effect almost perfectly. Not sure whether this can be directly implemented in Photoshop, but it should not be too difficult to do outside of it. So this defect may be a non-issue if you are shooting digitally! Besides, the important info for bird photos are mostly near the center of the frame. Hope this is not making your decision more difficult...
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