HKBWS BBS 香 港 觀 鳥 會 新 聞 組    Discussion Area 討論區    Photo Gallery 相片分享 I (Moderators: George_Ho, carmen, Forrest FONG, BBS Moderators, Kwok Jai)    Besra 松雀鷹 « Previous topic | Next topic » Pages: 1 2  Reply Send Topic Print    Author  Topic: Besra 松雀鷹  (Read 1310 times) Thomas_Chan BBS Member BBS God I love bird watching!     Posts: 432 Besra 松雀鷹 « on: Oct 16th, 2005, 2:11pm » Quote Modify http://images4.fotop.net/albums3/ThomasChan/Japanese_sparpowhawk/oct_16_ 05_4.jpg   http://images4.fotop.net/albums3/ThomasChan/Japanese_sparpowhawk/oct_16_ 05_6.jpg   16/10/2005 Tsim Bei Tsui 尖鼻咀 Leica 800mm + 20D ISO200 f5.6 1/640s, 1/800s « Last Edit: Oct 24th, 2005, 3:06pm by BBS Moderators » Logged Kwok Jai BBS Moderator BBS Member BBS Full Member I love bird watching!     Gender: Posts: 40 Re: Japanese Sparrowhawk 曰本松雀鷹 « Reply #1 on: Oct 16th, 2005, 5:24pm » Quote Modify they are male besra, if japanese sparrowhawk the tail should be shorter Logged Falcon BBS Member BBS God be like a falcon.....     Gender: Posts: 239 Re: Japanese Sparrowhawk 曰本松雀鷹 « Reply #2 on: Oct 16th, 2005, 7:21pm » Quote Modify Could it be a Crested Goshawk? Logged 努力不一定會成功，但不努力一定不會成功! Thomas_Chan BBS Member BBS God I love bird watching!     Posts: 432 Re: Japanese Sparrowhawk 曰本松雀鷹 « Reply #3 on: Oct 16th, 2005, 7:59pm » Quote Modify on Oct 16th, 2005, 7:21pm, Falcon wrote: Could it be a Crested Goshawk?   Falcon,     I don't think they are  Crested Goshawk.   Because its size like a Dove and its flying also like   a Dove, its tail longer than Dove.   Thomas. Logged Thomas_Chan BBS Member BBS God I love bird watching!     Posts: 432 Re: Japanese Sparrowhawk 曰本松雀鷹 « Reply #4 on: Oct 16th, 2005, 8:16pm » Quote Modify on Oct 16th, 2005, 5:24pm, Kwok Jai wrote: they are male besra, if japanese sparrowhawk the tail should be shorter   Kwok Jai,     Thanks for your identify!   Why they are male, not a couple?   Thomas. Logged Kwok Jai BBS Moderator BBS Member BBS Full Member I love bird watching!     Gender: Posts: 40 Re: Besra 松雀鷹 « Reply #5 on: Oct 16th, 2005, 9:00pm » Quote Modify because two birds size no different, if they are a couple some one should be bigger than next one. « Last Edit: Oct 16th, 2005, 9:23pm by Kwok Jai » Logged David_Diskin BBS Member BBS Senior Member I love bird watching!     Posts: 89 Re: Besra 松雀鷹 « Reply #6 on: Oct 16th, 2005, 9:03pm » Quote Modify I'm not sure these are Besras. Given their bulky-looking structure and the long 5th primary especially evident in the first photograph, I'd say they're adult Crested Goshawks.   dave diskin Logged Koel_Ko BBS Member BBS God I love birds!!     Gender: Posts: 222 Re: Besra 松雀鷹 « Reply #7 on: Oct 17th, 2005, 6:14am » Quote Modify Purely from the photos, I would say that the first one is a male Besra and the second one gives two Crested Goshawks.   The first bird has visibly thin feet, long 5th primary which creates a 'sharp' wingtip more indicative of Besra than Crested, and a relatively short bill that points towards Besra.   The second photo shows two birds with broad, rounded wings and bulky rear body, which seems to favour Crested Goshawk. Logged Thomas_Chan BBS Member BBS God I love bird watching!     Posts: 432 Re: Besra 松雀鷹 « Reply #8 on: Oct 17th, 2005, 7:30am » Quote Modify David Diskin, Koel Ko,   Thanks for your reply! The birds were so far away for me that I couldn't take   clear photos. I give you another two potos that may help to identify. http://images4.fotop.net/albums3/ThomasChan/Japanese_sparpowhawk/oct_16_ 05_5.jpg   http://images4.fotop.net/albums3/ThomasChan/Japanese_sparpowhawk/oct_16_ 05_7.jpg   Thomas. « Last Edit: Oct 17th, 2005, 5:12pm by Kwok Jai » Logged Thomas_Chan BBS Member BBS God I love bird watching!     Posts: 432 Re: Besra 松雀鷹 « Reply #9 on: Oct 17th, 2005, 7:48am » Quote Modify on Oct 16th, 2005, 9:00pm, Kwok Jai wrote: because two birds size no different, if they are a couple some one should be bigger than next one.   Kwok Jai,     Thanks for your reply!   How to explain their chest in difference colour?   Thomas. Logged David_Diskin BBS Member BBS Senior Member I love bird watching!     Posts: 89 Re: Besra 松雀鷹 « Reply #10 on: Oct 17th, 2005, 8:53am » Quote Modify I agree with Koel Ko that the two birds together are Crested Goshawks, The single bird does appear less bulky etc. than the Crested Goshawks, suggesting Besra.     However, in a recent discussion about some photos of accipiters taken at Po Toi, the wing formula of a male Besra shows the longest feathers to be P3 & 4, followed by 5, 2 ,1. The bird in the photo above seems to show P5 to be longer than P3.   Perhaps this is a variable feature and is of no significance when it comes to ID??   dave diskin   « Last Edit: Oct 17th, 2005, 9:00am by David_Diskin » Logged Kwok Jai BBS Moderator BBS Member BBS Full Member I love bird watching!     Gender: Posts: 40 Re: Besra 松雀鷹 « Reply #11 on: Oct 17th, 2005, 4:22pm » Quote Modify Thomas   this is  about the age.If adult male, the breast always has orange colour, but the immature birds the breast should be no orange.so the left bird is a adult and next is a imature.       kwok jai Logged gjcarey BBS Member BBS God     Posts: 115 Re: Besra 松雀鷹 « Reply #12 on: Oct 18th, 2005, 4:43pm » Quote Modify Structurally, the two birds appear to me to be Besras. They seem rather small and compact, with relatively short wings. The underwing coverts are heavily marked, which does not fit Crested Gos. Finally, does Crested Gos show orange irides? I don't remember ever having noticed this, while it is a consistent feature of adult male Besras. In addition, the head and upperparts, and especially the tail, of one of the birds, at least, appear rather too grey for Crested Gos.   Geoff Logged David_Diskin BBS Member BBS Senior Member I love bird watching!     Posts: 89 Re: Besra 松雀鷹 « Reply #13 on: Oct 19th, 2005, 8:05am » Quote Modify Thanks to Geoff for putting me right on this one. Interesting points.   Now where did I put that stamp collection .... ?   dave diskin Logged Koel_Ko BBS Member BBS God I love birds!!     Gender: Posts: 222 Re: Besra 松雀鷹 « Reply #14 on: Oct 19th, 2005, 4:31pm » Quote Modify Agreed. Thanks to Geoff for pointing out these features. 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