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Title: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by Little parrot on Apr 21st, 2005, 8:21pm They were found getting very close to a juvenile bird to take video and had scared the bird. http://mysinamail.sina.com.hk/cgi-bin/album/ualimage.cgi?egp=r]Gng3JGiJCgrXJgNwZIZW@3n3z33J5CZ_n&al=1&ph=2&brev=0 http://www.hkbws.org.hk/fileServer/webcreeper/News/ualimage%20r3.jpg (edited by Webcreeper on 25/4/05) |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@¬Æ»ò¤H?? Post by Webcreeper on Apr 21st, 2005, 8:29pm ÁÂÁÂÁ|³ø¡I ¥i§_§iª¾¤é´Á¡B®É¶¡©M¦aÂI¡H |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@¬Æ»ò¤H?? Post by Little parrot on Apr 21st, 2005, 9:45pm Photo taken this late afternoon at xxxxxxxxxx (edited by Webcreeper). When they found out being spy. They hided under the trees immediately and did not come out. Their behaviour had caused disturbance to the bird! |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by MaC_siu_kit on Apr 22nd, 2005, 1:41am scared the bird >:( >:( >:( ¨s³ºÊ\¦a°µÉA? ¬°¥ª¬ã¨s°¦¥®³¾???? |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by ³¾¤Í¢Ï(BWA) on Apr 22nd, 2005, 9:24pm «ù¥¤@ÂI¨Ó»¡¡AµL½×Æ[³¾¡B©ç³¾ÁÙ¬O°µ³¾Ãþ¬ã¨s¡A¦h¤Ö³£¥i¯à·|¼vÅT¨ì³¶³¾¡A¦b§¹¥þ¨S¦³¤zÂZ©M®`¦º³¶³¾¨âÓ·¥ºÝ¤§¶¡¡A¨ä¹ê¦³µL¼Æ¤£¦Pµ{«×ªº¦Ç¡C ·Ó¤ù¤¤ªº¨â¤H³£¬O¦³³Æ¦Ó¨Ó¡A¬Ý¨Ó¹ï³¾¨S¦³´c·N¡A¥u¬O·Q©ç¤@¨Ç·Ó¤ù©M°Êµe¡C¥®³¾µoı¦³¤H¡A·íµM·|¨üÅå°k¨«¡AÃöÁä¬O©ç³¾ªº¤H¦³¨S¦³½a°l¤£±Ë¡A³y¦¨¡u¹L¤À¡v¤zÂZ¡H¥Ñ©ó¸ê®Æ¦³¡A«ÜÃø»¡¼vÅT¦³¦h¤j¡A¦ý¬O¥LÌn°kÁשȳQ¤Hµo²{¡A¥i¨£¦³ÂI¤ßµê¡C ±q³¾ªº¨¤«×¬Ý¡A°¸µMµ¹¤@¡B¨âÓ¤HÆ[½à©Î©çÄá¥i¯à¨S¦³¬Æ»ò°ÝÃD¡A¦ý¬O¤H¦h¤F¼vÅT«K·|¿¼W¡A®e§Ô«×¦b¨º¸Ì¹ê¦bÃø»¡¡An¾a§Ų́̾}¤ß¦Û¦æ§PÂ_¡A¨Ã¥B®É¨èĵ¿ô¡C¨C·íµo²{µ}¦³³¾ºØ¡A³¾¤Í¡]©M¦n©_ªº¤H¡^«K·|»D·¦Ó¦Ü¡A¨s³º¦³¬Æ»ò¿ìªk¥i¥H±N¸sÅé²Ö¿nªº¤zÂZ´î¦Ü³Ì§C©O¡H ³Ì«á¡A°£¤F@¤ßÄU§iªì¤JªùªºªB¤Í¤§¥~¡A±N¤@¨Ç¦³°ÝÃDªº°µªk¦b³o¸Ì¤½¶}¡A§Q¥Î¸s²³ªºÀ£¤O¡AÀ³¸Ó¥i¥H°_¨ì¤@©wªºªýÀ~§@¥Î¡C To be fair, bird watching, bird photography and bird research will create some form of disturbance. There are countless shades of gray between zero disturbance and killing birds. I cannot see any bad intention in the two men, who seemed to be just going after some bird photos and footage. The young bird would certainly flee when it became aware of their presence. The key point is whether the men pursued it to the point of harassment, which I cannot tell from the photos. However, they did seem to be feeling uneasy, as they tried to escape from being watched. Birds probably won't mind being watched or photographed occasionally. However, damage will build up when the number of visitors increases. The limit is difficult to tell ¡V it is up to us to make a judgement from the bird's point of view. We should always remind ourselves of possible damage that we could bring. Bird watchers (and curious visitors) are naturally drawn to a rarity. How should we minimize the amount of cumulative disturbance? One last point: in addition to giving advice to beginners, I think we can exercise some social pressure by posting examples of questionable practices in this forum. |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by Little parrot on Apr 24th, 2005, 9:11am Agree that there is always disturbance to birds during bird watching, photographing and bird research but shouldn't we minimize it as far as possible. These two guys had gone to far and crossed the limit. I can't tell what other thing will they do in addition to taking video as I had broken their plan. They had been observed for a few minutes. I saw them emerged from the bushes and crawled toward the bird. The bird heard the noise and spotted toward their direction. When the bird saw them (less than 10 feet apart), it frightened and curled down in a defense manner and called. One of them even came closer to the bird to bend the grasses in front of the bird so that his partner could take clear good video. Though that man retreated afterward, could you accept this behaviour? What else will they do if they did not know that they were being watched?? The bird was roosted at the edge of a ridge and it couldn't fly yet! It could jump a short distance. Imagine what could happen if it accidentally fall down the cliff! I could not see any good reason for their behaviour. §Ú¦P·NÆ[³¾¡B©ç³¾©M°µ³¾Ãþ¬ã¨s³£·|¤zÂZ³¶³¾¡A¦ý¬O§Ú̬O¤£¬OÀ³¸Ó±N¤zÂZ¾¨¶q´î¨ì³Ì¤p©O¡H ³o¨â¦ì¤¯¥Sªº¦æ¬°¤Ó¹L¤À¡A¤w¸g¶W¶V¤F¬É½u¡C§Ú¤£ª¾¹D°£¤F©ç¼v¤ù¤§¥~¥LÌÁÙ¥´ºâ°µ¨Ç¬Æ»ò¡A¦]¬°§Ú¯}Ãa¤F¥L̪ºp¹º¡C§ÚÆ[¹î¤F¥L̼ƤÀÄÁ¡A¥Ḻq¾ðªL¤¤Æp¥X¨Ó¡A¦V¥®³¾ª¦¹L¥h¡C¥®³¾´ÂÁnµªº¨Ó·½±æ¹L¥h¡A¤@¨£¨ì¨â¤H¡]¶ZÂ÷¤Ö©ó10 ^§`¡^´NÅã±o«ÜÅå·W¡A¨÷¦±¨Åé¦Û½Ã¨Ãµo¥X¥sÁn¡C¨ä¤¤¤@¤H§ó¦V«e±µªñ¥®³¾¡A§é¦±¨e«e¤èªº¯ó¡A¥H«K¦P¦ñ©ç±o§ó²M·¡¡CÁöµM¨º¤H¤§«á°h¤F¤U¨Ó¡A§A¯à°÷±µ¨ü³oºØ°µªk¶Ü¡H¦pªG¤£ª¾¹D¦³¤H¦b¬Ý¡A¥LÌ·|¦A°µ¨Ç¬Æ»ò¡H¡H ¥®³¾¬O¯¸¦b±VÃ䪺¡A¤S¥¼À´±o¸¦æ¡I¨e¥u·|µu¶ZÂ÷¸õ´X¨B¡A·Q·Q¦pªG¨e±q±V¤W¶^¤U¥h¡A·|¦³¬Æ»ò«áªG¡I §Ú¬Ý¤£¥X¨º¨â¤Hªº¦æ¬°¦³¬Æ»ò¦n²z¥Ñ¡C W ¤¤Ä¶ |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by Yat-tung YU on Apr 24th, 2005, 3:15pm ³o©úÅã¬O¹Hªk¦æ¬°! ¥L̤wIJ¥Ç«OÅ@³¥¥Í³¾Ãþ±ø¨Ò(«UºÙ170±ø¨Ò), ¦p¦³³¾¤Íª¾¹D¥L̪º¨¤À,©Î¥H«á¦A¬Ý¨ì³o±¡ªp,½Ð³qª¾º®Å@¸p¡C½Öª¾¹Dº®Å@¸p¦Ì®H¦ÛµMÅ@²zû¿ì¤½«Ç¹q¸Ü,½Ð¯d¤U¡C |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by Webcreeper on Apr 24th, 2005, 5:57pm ¦Ì®H ??? on 04/21/05 at 17:23:34, Bena wrote:
½Ð°Ñ¦Ò¡G ¦p¦óÁ|³ø¶Ë®`³¶³¾ªº¨Æ¥ó? Report when Birds are Threatened (http://www.hkbws.org.hk/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=Conservation;action=display;num=1100610470)¡@ ;) |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by little_dolphin on Apr 24th, 2005, 9:58pm I agree that the actions of the above people is absolutely intolerable. The two people are already being hostile towards the young bird. >:( May I ask if there is other means of reporting illegal activities concerning wildlife besides calling the Mai Po AFCD office? Some of our members received disappointing replies when they reported the mudskipper collectors at the Deep Bay mudflats. Mudskipper collectors in Deep Bay "ªá³½¨Ð"¦A²{ÂZ¶Ã (http://www.hkbws.org.hk/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=Conservation;action=display;num=1113065894;start=0) |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by Webcreeper on Apr 25th, 2005, 12:58am ±o¨ì Little Parrot ªº¸É¥R¸ê®Æ¡AÅý¤j®a¤½¶}µûµû²z¡Aµý©ú¦h¼Æ¤H³£»{¦P¨º¨â¤Hªº°µªk¬O¤£¹ïªº¡A¹ê¦b«Ü¦³¡]¤Ï±¡^±Ð¨|·N¸q¡C With further details from Little Parrot, most of us would agree that the two men's action is unacceptable. This is good education (on what not to do). on 04/24/05 at 21:58:04, little_dolphin wrote:
¸g¹L¤§«e¦h½g¦³Ãöªá³½¨Ðªº¯d¨¥¡A¬Û«H·í§½·|©ú¥Õ¨ì¤µ®É¤µ¤éÀ³¸Ó±Ä¨ú§ó¿n·¥¥D°ÊªººA«×¡A§ÚÌ´NÄ~ÄòºÉ¥«¥Á¥»¥÷Á|³ø¡AµM«á«ø¥Ø¥H«Ý§a¡C Having seen so many reports about mudskipper collectors here, the authorities should now understand that a more postive approach is required. Let's continue to do our part - reporting disturbances - and see what happens. |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by Captain on Apr 25th, 2005, 9:11am ³o©úÅã¬O¹Hªk¦æ¬°! ¥L̤wIJ¥Ç«OÅ@³¥¥Í³¾Ãþ±ø¨Ò(«UºÙ170±ø¨Ò), ¦p¦³³¾¤Íª¾¹D¥L̪º¨¤À,©Î¥H«á¦A¬Ý¨ì³o±¡ªp,½Ð³qª¾º®Å@¸p¡C½Öª¾¹Dº®Å@¸p¦Ì®H ¦ÛµMÅ@²zû¿ì¤½«Ç¹q¸Ü,½Ð¯d¤U¡C Maybe they are already civil servants, so no need to report to the govt ;D ;D. The Yuen Long AFCD enforcement team no is 2474 2591 |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by bjingbar on Apr 25th, 2005, 9:28pm Firstly I must say that I don't know these 2 people, but I have a problem with the photo's, why is the bird ? blurred out?? I can't even tell if it is a bird. My main concern is allowing photos on the bulliten board that could be defamatory. If the author of the photo had blurred the faces of the 2 people it would have been OK, but as the BBS belongs to the society, all members of the society bear some responsibilty as to what is published on the board. I suggest that guidelines are published as to what photo's can be uploaded and what can't. Bob |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by Webcreeper on Apr 25th, 2005, 9:44pm Thanks Bob for the comment. I believe the bird in the photo was blurred because Little parrot doesn't want to attract any more attention to it. Please see my private message. Regarding guidelines for publishing photos in this BBS, we will work out something soon. Webcreeper |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by bjingbar on Apr 25th, 2005, 10:00pm I noticed that the country park was named in the original post, this particular country park is huge and it would be like looking for a needle in a haystack unless a map reference was given. I can't see the point of bluring the object (bird or whatever it is) I am extremely concerned about being able to identify these 2 people (and the society leaving itself open to a legal case) when the main point of the photo's is to show what these people are doing. The photo's get the point over even if we don't see these 2 peoples faces. Note how now the local newspapers and television blur peoples faces so the media organisations will not be sued |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by Little parrot on Apr 26th, 2005, 8:33pm Dear Bob, Noted your concern. Thank you. Please note that the subject of this thread explains clearly the purpose of these photos. Identity of the bird, where is the bird and what the men doing are not the primary concern! The identities of the men are critical if you complain to AFCD or Police. It is useless if you don¡¦t provide them with as much information as possible. The case will be recorded and then file to cabinet. Will AFCD/Police follow up who they are? I doubt! Concerning your worry on defamatory. I could not see any legal ground on it. May be you have other views? Please advise. My opinion is: Be firm and not to be threatened when the truth is with you. After all, talk about conservation is easy, taking part in is challenging. Should we take a step further when we can? |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by bjingbar on Apr 26th, 2005, 8:57pm Little Parrot, I agree that when dealing directly with the relevant authorities it is neccessary to be able to identify the people but this is an open (public) forum and in my opinion the faces should have been blurred, I note that they now have been blurred. I have worked all my life in media related companies and am fully aware of the potential problems, when it comes to showing people without their permission. Bob |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by birdwatcher on May 2nd, 2005, 11:01am on 04/25/05 at 09:11:36, Captain wrote:
They are staff of AFCD! |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by little_dolphin on May 2nd, 2005, 5:05pm on 05/02/05 at 11:01:52, birdwatcher wrote:
Why? ??? |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by Little parrot on May 8th, 2005, 9:23am AFCD confirmed that they are their staff. I had sent an e-mail enquiry to AFCD seeking advice on this case and a Ms. Y.N. Ngar replied on 3 May 2005. I further wrote to her to ask for clarification and she replied again on 6/5/2005. Her replies are attached below: -------------------------------------------------- First reply: Dear X, Thank you for sending me two photos on 30 April, 05. I notice that the object being blurred is a XXX. Judging from the photo, there is no visible / concrete evidence that their action was in breach of the Cap. 170 Wild Animal Protection Ordinance, i.e. hunt or wilfully disturb any protected wild animal, their nests or eggs (regulations 4 and 5 refers). The two subject persons were just trying to take photos / video of the bird. You may wish to notice that our staff are required to carry out ecological surveys in the country parks and even other countryside to collect valuable ecological data. As seen from your photos, and further check with internal staff, the two?persons were in fact our staff (but really can't see clearly their faces). They knew the XXX site years before, and they were re-visiting the site to update the ecological information of that bird species. They had to be rather close to the bird so that they could make detailed and in-depth observations and records of the bird species, so as to gain a better knowledge of the bird for building up a comprehensive ecological database. Please result assured that our staff on ecological survey are professionally trained, well prepared and aimed to collect ecological data for nature conservation only. They dressed themselves in subdue colour and hided among the bushes to avoid, on one hand, scaring the bird, and on the other hand, attracting unintended public attention. This explained why they quickly hide themselves away once they noticed being spyed from behind. They looked back and found out that you (with another lady) were bird-watchers probably without intention to harm the birds, hence they stayed on the site to continue their work. Your high concern on bird protection is understandable. However, I am afraid it was not a desirable way, nor legally acceptable way, to report a suspected illegal activity and ask for suspect's identity openly in a website. Please note that the privacy of the suspect is legally protected, not to mention that the photos even didn't show any wilful action at all. In future, if there is any suspected illegal activity, you may inform AFCD directly (through phone, ICC, email, or report to enforcement staff in the countryside) or the police for investigation. Hope this has clarified the case and eased your concern. Regards, Ms Y. N. Ngar Country Parks Ranger Officer, Agriculture, Fisheries and Conservation Department -------------------------------------------------------- Second reply: Dear X, Below are my responses: 1. We have already made reference to the photos you provided, your descriptions of the behaviour of our two staff, our investigation with the two staff and my field inspection to the subject site, before reaching the conclusion that their action did not breach the Cap. 170. There is no sufficient evidence to substantiate a prosecution case. However, please let us know if you could provide any new evidence to support your accusation. 2. I reiterate that our staff were discharging their official duty to carry out ecological study at the Tai Lam Reservoir area. Their intention is to collect ecological information, and they have taken every precautionary steps to avoid disturbing the birds. The bird information serves to improve our understanding of the ecology, hence the formulation of better conservation strategies. Besides, the images of the bird so acquired are to benefit the public in the form of publications, video and scientific papers. 3. For other suspected cases in the future, you may report to the Mai Po Office of AFCD at 2471-4411, 2474 8974 or 2476 9430. However, the Integrated Calls Centre (ICC) set up by the government which number is 1823 could offer one-stop and 24-hours service to you. The ICC was set up since 2001 and well known to the public. Ms Y. N. Ngar AFCD |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by Webcreeper on May 8th, 2005, 11:21am Little Parrot ´¿¦Vº®Å@¸p¬d¸ß¡Aº®Å@¸pªº Y. N. Ngar ¤p©j¡]Country Parks Ranger Officer¡A¥³¥¤½¶éÅ@²z¥D¥ô¡^¤À§O¦b¤¤ë¤T¤é©M¤»¤é§@¤F¦^ÂСA¥H¤U¬O¸p¤è¦^ÂÐ ªº¤º®eºKn¡G ®Ú¾Ú Little Parrot ¦Vº®Å@¸p´£¨Ñªº·Ó¤ù¡B³ø§i©M·í§½¨ì²{³õªºµø¹î¡A¨ÃµL¹ê½èÃÒ¾ÚÅã¥Ü¨â¤H¹H¤Ï¡m³¥¥Í°Êª««OÅ@±ø¨Ò¡n¡e²Ä170³¹¡f*¡C ¨º¨â¤H½T¹ê¬Oº®¹A¦ÛµMÅ@²z¸p¾û¡A¥L̦h¦~«e¤wª¾¹D¨ºÓ¦a¤è¡A¦Ó·í®É¥¿¦b·j¶°¦³Ãö¨ººØ³¾ªº¥ÍºA¸ê®Æ¡A»Ýn±µªñ¨º³¾§@§ó¸Ô²ÓªºÆ[¹î©M°O¿ý¡C©Ò±oªº¸ê®Æ·|¥Î¨Ó«Ø¥ß§ó§¹¾ãªº¥ÍºA¼Æ¾Ú®w¡A¥H«K¨î©w§ó¦nªº«O¨|¬Fµ¦¡A©ç±oªº¼v¶H·|§@¥Xª©©M¬ì¬ã¥Î³~¡A¦³§Q¤j²³¡C º®Å@¸pªº¥ÍºA½Õ¬dû³£¨ü¹L±M·~°V½m¡A¥L̬ïµÛ§C½Õªº¦çªA¡AÁôÂæb¾ðÂO¤¤¡A¥H§KÅåÀ~³¶³¾¡A¦P®ÉÁקK¤Þ°_¤½²³ª`·N¡C¦]¦¹¥L̤@µo²{¦³¤H¦b«á¿s¦ø¡A«K¥ß§Y¸ú°_¨Ó¡A¦ý¬O·íµoı Little Parrot ©M¦P¦æ¤@¦ì¤k¤h¬OÆ[³¾ªÌ¡A¹ï³¾¨S¦³´c·N¤§«á¡A«KÄ~Äò¤u§@¡C ±NÃhºÃªº«Dªk¬¡°Ê¦bºô¤Wµo§G¡A¤½¶}¸ß°ÝºÃ¤Hªº¨¥÷¡A¨Ã¤£¬O«ê·íªº°µªk¡Aªk«ß¤]¤£®e³\¢w¢w¨ü¶û¤Hª«ªº¨pÁô¨üªk«ß«OÅ@¡A¦Ó¥B·Ó¤ù¨Ã¨S¦³Åã¥Ü´c·N¦æ¬°¡C¤é«á¦pªGÃhºÃ¦³«Dªk¦æ¬°¡A¥iª½±µ³qª¾º®Å@¸p¡]¹q¸Ü¡Bºî¦X¹q¸Ü¬d¸ß¤¤¤ß¡B¹q¶l¡B©Î¦b¥³¥·íȪº°õªk¤Hû¡^©Îĵ¤è¶i¦æ½Õ¬d¡C ¦Ì®Hº®Å@¸p¹q¸Ü¡@2471-4411, 2474 8974 ©Î 2476 9430 ¬F©²ºî¦X¹q¸Ü¬d¸ß¤¤¤ß¡]ICC¡^1823 ¤]¥i´£¨Ñ24¤p®É¤@¯¸¦¡ªA°È *Ķª`¡G»´äªk¨Ò²Ä170³¹ ²Ä¥|±ø¡G¥ô¦ó¤H°£«ö·Ó¯S§O³\¥iÃÒ¦æ¨Æ¥~¡A¤£±o¬¼Ây©Î¬G·N¤zÂZ¥ô¦ó¨ü«OÅ@³¥¥Í°Êª«¡C ²Ä¤±ø¡G¥ô¦ó¤H°£«ö·Ó¯S§O³\¥iÃÒ¦æ¨Æ¥~¡A¤£±o¨ú¥h¡B²¾¨«¡B·l®`¡B¾P·´©Î¬G·N¤zÂZ¥ô¦ó¨ü«OÅ@³¥¥Í°Êª«ªº±_©Î³J¡C W ºKĶ |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by little_dolphin on May 8th, 2005, 12:20pm on 04/24/05 at 09:11:07, Little parrot wrote:
on 05/08/05 at 09:23:27, Little parrot wrote:
I suppose the AFCD staffs need even more training on how to collect ecological data without disturbing the research subject, perhaps training on basic animal behaviour. :-/ Maybe they also need some better equipments that allow them to video the bird further away (than 10 feet), like the telephoto lenses photographers use to film subjects very far away. In the past (more than 50 years ago), researchers used to shoot animals in the field and cut open their stomaches just to investigate what they eat. Today this is ethically unacceptable. Thanks to increased concern to the natural environment and animal welfare, researches and any activities on wildlife today are conducted to disturb the animals as little as possible, if at all. I personally believe that making a baby bird "curling down and calling" already constitutes some harassment to it that should be avoidable. I suppose the video that the AFCD wanted to take is a young bird behaving naturally, not one that is "frightened and curled down in a defense manner and called". That said, even though the two AFCD staffs are conducting an ecological survey, their behaviour is not acceptable as researchers today. Hope the AFCD can improve on future surveys. |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by birdwatcher on May 8th, 2005, 9:42pm Approaching a young bird to within a few meter is causing disturbance for sure. If this is allowed, all nests are in trouble. Taking picture is not the same as doing survey, if it is the case, we have many researchers here. I don't see any bird survey properly published by AFCD, do you? |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by little_dolphin on May 9th, 2005, 1:00pm That depends on what they mean by "bird survey". Maybe they think taking photos for pamphlets is one type of "bird survey". ;D The AFCD has some bird research projects posted here (http://www.afcd.gov.hk/conservation/eng/b_study.htm), but all of them are done by either the HK Bird Watching Society or WWF of HK. ;D |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by Bob Thompson on May 10th, 2005, 8:39am Try this site http://www.hkbiodiversity.net/html/en/speciesgroup_index.html |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by ¸ô¤H¤A on May 11th, 2005, 5:40pm I wonder what kind of ecological surveys they did? |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by Bob Thompson on May 11th, 2005, 6:35pm on 05/11/05 at 17:40:45, ¸ô¤H¤A wrote:
Did you check out the website which is mentioned in the posting directly before yours !!!!!!!! |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by ¸ô¤H¥Ò on May 11th, 2005, 8:27pm I've visited the website. It just mentioned (claimed) some studies on birds are carrying out but I couldn't find any research paper or, at least, raw data released on the website. It said "Results of these studies will enhance our knowledge about these species and facilitate the implementation of conservation measures." But where is the results?? I doubt if they are really carrying out researches/studies. |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by Bob Thompson on May 11th, 2005, 10:58pm Being a loyal member of the Hong Kong Bird Watching Society I challenge the other writers of this thread to change their user profile so that their REAL NAME is revealed and to state whether they are members of the society. Bob Thompson membership no. A00465 |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by ³¾¤Í¢Ï(BWA) on May 12th, 2005, 1:28pm I agree with Bob - we have to be responsible for what we say in this forum. ³¾¤ÍA (BWA) is Alan Chan, membership no. A00041 Also known as Webcreeper when working as the Moderator. |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by ¸ô¤H¥Ò on May 12th, 2005, 1:32pm Please reply your message relavent to this thread. We are discussing about ecological surveys carried out by AFCD. (Sorry! Should be the two people in the photos) In response to your post, I don't think my real name or even others' real name has to be put in the profile. In addition, this BBS is open for public. Everyone, no matter he/she is member of HKBWS or not, can post their message and express their views here. If you do think putting real name in profile is necessary for all users of this BBS, I suggest you to inform HKBWS or webmaster of this BBS, or open a new thread in the "General" section. |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by little_dolphin on May 12th, 2005, 5:00pm Dear all, If anyone here wish to identify me, my name is Rex Au Yeung, membership no. A00023. I do not have any other aliases on this BBS. If any of my comments on this thread did offend anyone, I sincerely apologise. Concerning the subject of this thread, the following is my stance: I totally agree that photographs and live videos of wildlife is crucial for educating the public on the natural environment in any place of the world. Also, ecological studies are important for improving our understanding of natural habitats and their inhabitants. It is the responsibility of conservation agencies of every nation Today, thanks to the animal rights movement, it is a moral obligation to ensure that any human activities on wildlife, whether it is research, birdwatching, dolphin-watching, fishing, or others do not disturb the animals living in their natural habitat. If disturbance is unavoidable, then it should be minimised as much as possible. Until now, the only information we have on the situation are Little Parrot's photos and his description of the event. If Little Parrot's description is correct, I do suspect the two AFCD staffs are causing disturbance the bird to some degree. However, if the information is proven to be wrong, I would be more than happy to take back all my comments. In my opinion, it is not futile to argue whether the AFCD has conducted any ecological studies, is conducting any, or just plain wants to take pictures and videos of birds and post them up to the HK Biodiversity Net mentioned by Mr Thompson for the public's reference. It is quite pointless to argue whether taking photos constitute an ecological survey too. Both photos and surverys are crucial for increasing our understanding of our natural environment and the species within. Any efforts made by the AFCD on nature conservation helps our environment, and therefore should be appreciated by us. As I do not wish to be further involved in the argument in this thread, I will not post any further comments here. I apologise again if any of the above offends anybody. Wish all of you continue to enjoy watching birds and wild animals. Best regards, Rex Au Yeung (Little Dolphin) |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by ³¾¤Í¢Ï(BWA) on May 12th, 2005, 6:27pm I think that everyone may choose to remain anonymous in this forum. However I naturally wonder what's happening having seen the same question being echoed by 3 unknown persons within the last 3 days. Do you? on 05/08/05 at 21:42:24, birdwatcher wrote:
on 05/11/05 at 20:27:56, ¸ô¤H¥Ò wrote:
on 05/11/05 at 17:40:45, ¸ô¤H¤A wrote:
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by ¸ô¤H¤A on May 12th, 2005, 8:37pm I'm Karen Law, membership no is A00293. ¸ô¤H¤A is my only alia in this BBS. Indeed, I have visited this forum for a long time, but seldom post message here. I speak up this time coz I think the AFCD staffs' behaviour is unacceptable!! After I read the AFCD hp posted by Bob Thompson, I am really curious to know why the staffs did ecological survey in that way. I'm sorry that I can't find any hint from that hp. That's why I raised my question. However, my enquiry is still unsolved . I realise that people always have different views on this issue. But what I strongly believe is that doing research is not an excuse to violate animal right. Everyone should respect the nature. Birdwatcher, or ecologist, or photographer, or whoever, please be considerate of the wildlife. And... HKBWS is an open forum. Everyone, no matter he is HKBWS member or not, can state his viewpoint here. Also, he has the right to be anonymous if he really doesn't want to disclose his idenity. |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by ³¾¤Í¢Ï(BWA) on May 12th, 2005, 9:15pm Thanks Rex and Karen for the clarification. We have much more credibility when we make comments in person, especially on such a sensitive issue. I don't think it is necessary to take video of the bird at the close distance shown in Little Parrot's photos, particularly when the bird was disturbed in the process. I believe AFCD do use their survey results for decision making. Whether they publish the findings is another matter. However if they do we would certainly benefit from a better understanding of the birds in Hong Kong. |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by ¸ô¤H¥Ò on May 14th, 2005, 12:54am I appologize for my rude message. I know what you're concerning now. Sorry! I am Vicky Yeung, membership no: A00554. ¸ô¤H¥Òis my alia and the only alia in HKBWS BBS. I have been visiting this BBS for quite a long time and act as an observer most of the time. I love bird watching and I love birds too. I don't want to see any birds being disturbed by human, esp. bird watchers and those who claim they work for the environment. And this time, I do think the two people in the pictures were disturbing the bird/nest and that's why I post message to express my feelings here! The pictures didn't tell much on what the two people were doing, but it is obvious that they know there is a bird nest and they were at a position that is unacceptably close to it. Moreover, the AFCD staff said in the letter that the two people in the pic were doing ecological survey for AFCD. Ecological survey is a way to understand the nature and wildlife but not to disturb and destroy them. I don't think doing ecological survey could be the reason for disturbing wildlife. If that could be a reason, even the midskipper collectors in MP mudflat could claim that they were carrying out ecological studies on mudskipper in MP!! If that could be a reason, HK won't be a good birding place. And good birding places could only be countries with no ecological surveys and no ecologists!! I sincerely hope all of us (you) enjoy bird watching, and most importantly, love birds and respect our environment. |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by ³¾¤Í¢Ï(BWA) on May 14th, 2005, 9:36am Thanks Vicky! The above posts bring out clearly how people think about the incident. |
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Title: Re: Do U know them??¡@§A»{ÃÑ¥L̶Ü?? Post by Little parrot on May 15th, 2005, 11:14am After going through the posts on this thread again, I see that the majority here is care about birds and is discontented with the behaviour of the men. I just naturally wonder what is Bob¡¦s stance? |
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